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Minas Tirith Forums » Other Tolkien Productions » Led Zeppelin used Tolkien in song. (Page 3)
Author Topic: Led Zeppelin used Tolkien in song.
Roll of Honor Snaga
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quote:
William Shakespear probably did use this phrase first. I'm open to that suggestion.
Again, no offense, but this isn't a suggestion, it is a fact. Merchant of Venice, 2.6. line 66:

"All that glisters is not gold;
Often have you heard that told.
Many a man his life hath sold.
But my outside top behold.
Gilded tombs do worms unfold..."

Of course Tolkien knew this quote and it is a very old theme (appearences are often deceiving - good and bad) and chose to play with it in his description of Aragorn - both in Bilbo's poem and Frodo referring to Strider and the whole looking fair vs. feeling fair discussion. I'm not saying Tolkien "stole" anything - I'm sure he assumed his reference was immediately obvious to anyone who knew his/her literature.

I tried to write that without sounding snotty, and I am not sure I succeeded. Even people who have never read Shakespeare quote him and his ideas all the time - read any play and you will be amazed at how many of Shakespeare's ideas permeate our culture - it is all there.

If Tolkien knew that people took up Shakespeare as a result of reading his books, well I'm sure he would have been thrilled.

[ 02-14-2003, 11:33 AM: Message edited by: Snaga ]

From: Mordor - upper east side | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Durin's Bane
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quote:
But is'nt it possible that Tolkien may have used phrases from W.S.
Snaga, I believe the we agree on this point. By the way Tolkien did influence me to read more British literature.

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Pour me somthing tall and strong, make it a hurricane before I go insane. It's only half past twelve, but I don't care, it's five-o-clock somewhere.

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Roll of Honor Snaga
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quote:
Snaga, I believe the we agree on this point. By the way Tolkien did influence me to read more British literature.
\

Hi DB! I in no way meant to imply you had not read any british lit or that I am in any way more literate than you or anyone else - I'm not saying you interpeted me in this way either - it's just, well you know how these chat things can go sometimes and I just wanted to make sure you knew I wasn't being a snot!

Somewhat off topic, I do something a little odd when reading Shakespeare that helps me to understand just what the heck is going on. I get a copy of an audio tape of a play from the library and read along with it. I find the combination - a sort of poor mans multimedia experience - really helpful. Some of the tapes are awful - these actors really ham it up when given a little leeway - but overall it is kind of fun. Plus, by looking at the tape you know exactly how long it will take to read a certain play - King Lear, 3 hours and 47 minutes!

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Durin's Bane
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Found this from The Tolkien Society.

Tolkien Ensemble CD: The Tolkien Ensemble, one of the few musical groups to be given permission by the Tolkien Estate to set JRR Tolkien’s poetry to music, has released its third CD, “Dawn in Rivendell” in a premiere introduced by Christopher Lee. More information on Tolkien Ensemble CD here.

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Pour me somthing tall and strong, make it a hurricane before I go insane. It's only half past twelve, but I don't care, it's five-o-clock somewhere.

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Estel Lomëwen
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Oooh, cool! I've always wanted to hear the poems put to music. I have a tape of Tolkien reading some of them, but I think he knew he wasn't going to do them justice so it's more of a sing-songy voice than actual singing.

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I'm on fire, when You're near me
I'm on fire when You speak
And I'm on fire burning at these mysteries

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Iarnar the Desert Dog
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I haven't seen either of these Led Zep references mentioned, either here or on that other website.

From Led Zeppelin IV (aka "Zoso," or "The Faggot Album" (see below)), in the song Going to California:

"The Mountains and the Canyons start to tremble and shake,
The Children of the Sun begin, to awake (watch out)"

Didn't JRRT somewhere refer to Men as "The Children of the Sun?"

From Houses of the Holy, the song No Quarter always seemed to be about the Fellowship's Journey ("The Devil mocks their every step", etc).

Note: No offense intended. This is what myself and my friends who were fans of JRRT and Led Zep jokingly called the untitled album, because the guy on the cover is carrying a faggot of wood on his back, much like the Fellowship carried faggots when they were trying to climb Caradhras.

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Snöwdog
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quote:
From Led Zeppelin IV (aka "Zoso," or "The Faggot Album"
Ah yes, how terminology has changed, or should I say, was hijacked??
Faggot = a bundle of sticks
Fag = a cigarette
Gay = happy
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I remember when Zep 4 came out and I took my copy home to listen to. I never thought Stairway would be the monster hit it is. In my opinion there are many (most) other songs on that album that are better. Also, not having read Lord of the Rings at that time, the Tolkien story references weren't obvious to me until a few years later.

Bob Dylan has many a good album, but I have to say Blood on the Tracks and Desire are a couple of his best.

[ 03-06-2003, 09:41 AM: Message edited by: Snowdog ]

From: In the Shadows of Annuminas | Registered: Aug 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Estel Lomëwen
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LOL, faggot... I remember being so confused by that the first time I read LOTR - it was only about 4 years ago. I was twelve. It took me days to figure out the "old" meaning of the word. I was like "Why are they carrying gay people up the mountain? And lighting them on fire?" It was very strange. []

So how come nobody's posted much of anything here lately?

EDITed for spelling []

[ 04-07-2003, 01:25 PM: Message edited by: Estel Lomëwen ]

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
I'm on fire, when You're near me
I'm on fire when You speak
And I'm on fire burning at these mysteries

From: in a sunburned land... | Registered: Jul 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Snöwdog
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quote:
Estel Lomëwen said: "So how come nobody's posted much of anything here lately?"
Who knows.

About Led Zeppelin, they played quite a "reunion" show! Plant sounded great and Page, despite appearing tired after an hour, [played well through it all. John Paul Jones played his steady part, and Jason 'Bonzo' filled dad's shoes well while adding a bit of his own mor structured style to it! Can't wait for the DVD to be released! Here was their set-list:

01. Good Times, Bad Times
02. Ramble On
03. Black Dog
04. In My Time Of Dying
05. For Your Life
06. Trampled Under Foot
07. Nobody's Fault But Mine
08. No Quarter
09. Since I've Been Loving You
10. Dazed and Confused
11. Stairway To Heaven
12. The Song Remains the Same
13. Misty Mountain Hop
14. Kashmir


Encore:

15. Whole Lotta Love
16. Rock and Roll

From: In the Shadows of Annuminas | Registered: Aug 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
The Witch-King of Angmar
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quote:
Ah yes, how terminology has changed, or should I say, was hijacked??
Faggot = a bundle of sticks
Fag = a cigarette
Gay = happy

Regarding colloquy:

"Faggot" = a bundle of sticks for burning, so it was shortened to "fag" for a cigarette being something similar (a bundle of tobacco for burning).

This word is also the shortened version of Yiddish word "fagala" which actually refers to a 'mo, and so it became confused with the word "faggot."
"Gay" also used to be used as slang for a prostitute in the 18th century.

From: Los Angeles, CA, USA | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Snöwdog
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Judging by all the cameras that could be seen on the amateur videos that have appeared on youtube, there surely will be a DVD release of this show sometime in the future! []
From: In the Shadows of Annuminas | Registered: Aug 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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