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Minas Tirith Forums » New Line Cinema's Lord of the Rings » About Galadriel (Page 1)
Author Topic: About Galadriel
Éowyn
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I've got a question:
In FotR, when Frodo offers the Ring to Galadriel at her mirror, she suddenly is surrounded by green light. But in the Book it says:

>She lifted up her white arms, and spread out her hands towards the Eastin a gesture of rejection and denial. Earendil, the Evening star, most beloved of the Elves, shone clear above. So bright was it that the figure on the Elven-lady cast a dim shadow on the ground. Its rays glanced upon a ring about her finger; it glittered like polished gold overlaid with silver light, and a white stone in it twinkled as if the Even-star had come down to rest upon her hand. Frodo gazed at the ring with awe; for suddenly it seemed to him that he understood.
...
"You are wise and fearless and fair, Lady Galadriel," said Frodo."I will give you the One Ring, if you ask for it. It is too great a matter for me."
Galadriel laughed with a sudden clear laugh. "Wise the Lady Galadriel may be," she said," yet here she has met her match in courtesy. Gently are you revenged for my testing of your heart at our first meeting. You begin to see with a keen eye. I do not deny that my heart has greatly desired to ask what you offer. For many long years I had pondered what might do, should the Great Ring come into my hands, and behold! it was brought within my grasp. The evil that was deviced long ago works on in many ways, whether Sauron himself stands or falls. Would not that have been a noble deed to set to the credit of his Ring, if I had taken it by force or fear from my guest?
And now at last it comes. You will give me the Ring freely! In place of the Dark Lokrd you will set up a Queen. And I shall not be dark, but beautiful and terrible as the Morning and the Night! Fair as the Sea and the Sun and the Snow upon the Mountain! Dreadful as the Storm and the Lightning! Stronger than the foundations of the earth. All shall love me and despair!"
She lifted up her hand and from the ring she worde there issued a great light that illumined her alone and left all else dark. She stood before Frodo, seeming how tall beyond measurement, and beautiful beyond enduring, terrible and worshipful. Then she let her hand fall, and the light faded, and suddenly she laughed again, and lo! she was shrunken: a slender elf-woman, clad in simple white, whose gentle voice was soft and sad.
"I pass the test," she said." I will diminish, and go into the West, and remain Galadriel."

The Text she says is rather like in the books, but not the light, her ring, and the star of Earendil.
Before I had read the books, I always asked myself, why she suddenly was green and spoke in a deep voice. In the book, I understand the szene, but oddly enough not in the movie.

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Roll of Honor Varnafindë
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The movie scene seems to emphasize her as terrible and dreadful, and ignore some of the other aspects mentioned in the book.
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Roll of Honor Neytari Took-Baggins
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Watch the movies as movies. They are not the books. To keep them separate is to enjoy both immensly. To compare them is to make yourself grouchy []

The movies have more suspense than the books because film is a different medium. The effects used during Galadriel's speech in the film are meant to convey that she is seriously tempted. She's not just telling Frodo what would happen, she's showing him. Film has to rely on showing, you know. Too much talking makes a dull film (just like too much description can ruin books for some).


I'll save Wiki some time and make his post for him:

"PJ is an incompetant fool no one can act way too many bad effects everything sucks PJ is an incompetant fool everything sucks the writing not taken from the book is terrible PJ is an incompetant fool everything sucks and the people who like the films are illiterate."

[]

[ 01-15-2006, 06:17 PM: Message edited by: Neytari Took-Baggins ]

From: California ainrofilaC | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
The Witch-King of Angmar
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A word of advice: avoid putting your words in other people's mouths, and you'll avoid putting your foot in your own. []

Rather since you mention it, the passage was misinterpreted in the genre that PJ understands-- cheap horror movies. Thus, it wasn't a grand vision, but a horric one-- complete with the black-and-white, creepy witch-like appearance, and eerie green light etc.

Likewise, the fact that such a vision would have become horrific, was simply voiced by Galadriel herself, when the humble Sam tells her "I wish you'd take the Ring, Lady; then you'd put things to rights."
And Galadriel answers: "Yes; but it would not end that way."

The problem in the movie, however, isn't just the special-effects or the portrayal; rather, it's that the entire moral of the story is lost, if the characters cannot use the Ring-- but are tempted merely by its power solely to TEMPT them to use it-- at which point Sauron's huge electric eyeball says "PEEK-A-BOO..... I SEEEEEEEE YOU!"
In other words, the Ring temps one to use it, in order to reveal itself to Sauron and get back to him. (It IS evil, you know... and the movie leaves no doubt about that... like EVERYTHING evil in the movie-- thus losing any hint of realism, since there wouldn't be much evil in the world if it was that repulsive and obvious).

The story, rather is not simply about avoiding temptation, but about the fact that power WORKS-- however it also corrupts. Boromir tells Frodo in the book, "The Ring would give me the power of command." And thus, no doubt he would command all men-- even his enemies, the Southrons, Easterlings and Corsairs-- all under his rule; and thus the war could be won by his brilliant military tactics and he would become king.
But as Galadriel knows, "it would not end that way;" Boromir might indeed win, but as Frodo warns Faramir, Minas Tirith would become another Minas Morgul.

But how can power corrupt, if it DOESN'T work? That's not REAL temptation-- it's simply GULLIBILITY, i.e. being easily lured in by the false... which is pretty darned pathetic when everyone KNOWS that it's false!

And that's not much of a moral, since it's eclipsed by the moral of "fool me once, shame on you-- fool me twice, shame on ME." And Numenor HAD been fooled before by the Ring; they KNEW the Ring was evil. If "it answers only to Sauron," as the movie claimed, then one would have to be hopelessly stupid to be tempted by it again; even Sam, a Hobbiton gardener, saw through that one: one would expect that Galadriel, probably the wisest in all of Middle-Earth, wouldn't even think it worth considering-- but rather just one more trap set by the Enemy, whom she had out-witted for time immemorial. As she tells Frodo, "Long has he searched for me-- but the Door is still closed!"

As such, Galadriel's temptation is diminished into her simply wising up to a con-job, like some old lady about to lose her savings-- rather than the dreadful, real-world meaning of being forced to make the right, but agonizing, choice of duty over the survival and continuation of her entire great people, for which she is responsible!

Thus, Frodo is not merely testing her, as she tested him by pretending to offer something she could not; he truly WILL give her the Ring, willingly and without her using force, or even asking for it. And so, her choice is truly a historical moment.

As such, those who understand the enormous significance of the story, will thus realize the depravity of its flawed telling; thus,
to keep the movies and book separate, you'd practically have to have two heads.

The IDEAL solution would be to make another movie; but until then, one can only acknowledge the fact that great works naturally draw many cheap imitators.

[ 01-15-2006, 08:36 PM: Message edited by: The Witch-King of Angmar ]

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The Dread Pirate Roberts
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quote:
The movies have more suspense than the books because film is a different medium. The effects used during Galadriel's speech in the film are meant to convey that she is seriously tempted. She's not just telling Frodo what would happen, she's showing him. Film has to rely on showing, you know. Too much talking makes a dull film (just like too much description can ruin books for some).

I have to disagree. These movies do not have more suspense than the books. Not even close, really.

As for the need for film to rely on showing rather than telling, I also disagree. In fact the opposite is true. The best films have the best dialog, the most coherent stories, and the fewest action sequences. "It Happened One Night" is one of the greatest films ever, for example, and it is ALL because of dialog.

Film isn't all about showing and not telling. Lets look at a different genre, for discussion purposes. Compare "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" to "House of Flying Daggers."

HoFD is clearly the better film visually. There are scenes in it that are so beautiful the viewer is nearly moved to tears. CTHD, however, is a much better film. Why? The acting, dialog, and story are far more compelling.

That's all I really have time for at the moment but I had to answer these assertions. The glowing Galadriel may be the worst scene of all three movies. (Then again, "What do we owe Gondor?" and "Go home, Sam," were pretty bad, too.)

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The Witch-King of Angmar
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Oh, and I suppose "If you want him, COME AND CLAIM HIM!" was a classic great moment in film-history? []

Actually I mark that one down as the worst of the worst-- along with "A ranger, caught off his guard?" []

Without the Rape of Arwen-- and in a manner that trivialized the experience of her mother with the orcs-- the films would have maybe been possible to stomach; at least Galadriel didn't swing on a rope or anything cheesy or cliche' like that.

[ 01-23-2006, 01:44 AM: Message edited by: The Witch-King of Angmar ]

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Snöwdog
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quote:
"I suppose "If you want him, COME AND CLAIM HIM!" was a classic great moment in film-history?

Actually I mark that one down as the worst of the worst-- along with "A ranger, caught off his guard?"

I have to agree.

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
- Bilbo Baggins

"These Lord of the Rings movies must be taken deep into Mordor and cast back into the fiery chasm from whence they came."

Middle Earth Angling Guide

Avatar: Shadow Ranger
Artwork by Jonathon Earl Bowser

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The Witch-King of Angmar
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That's the sole thing that caused me to BOYCOTT the first movie. I wonder if they toned down Arwen's later involvement due to complaints?
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Arien the Maia
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quote:
In the book, I understand the szene, but oddly enough not in the movie.
I believe that the whole thing , the light, the change of voice, the change of face -cause her face does change too- and of course the change of cloths -wath carefuly and you will see a metal chest armour -I really have no idea how that's called in english- is done to give you a glimpse of Galadriel should she have taken the ring for her own.
A glimpse of Galadriel according to PJ of course.

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Thingol of Doriath
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quote:
That's the sole thing that caused me to BOYCOTT the first movie.
[] Come on Wiki... you boycotted the movie? The way you go on and on and on and on(etc;) about the movies leaves little doubt that you have seen them more than all of us combined. You have made PJ and very happy(and rich) man. []

You alone keep the movies alive... []

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Miranthridel Bloom
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*Adds to her "Why the world loves S/Thingy list* []
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The Witch-King of Angmar
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quote:
Come on Wiki... you boycotted the movie? The way you go on and on and on and on(etc;) about the movies leaves little doubt that you have seen them more than all of us combined. You have made PJ a very happy(and rich) man.
No, I didn't pay to see the first one: I caught the first one on cable-- and speeded through the "Arwen" parts. I only watched the others one time each-- just to see how bad they were. Needless to say, I wasn't disappointed.
Maybe I just have a better MEMORY than some. In fact, I downloaded them just to see the EE scenes- and ERASED them afterward.

Total spent: about $10-- with customers like me, he'd have gone broke.

The Harry Potter movies have made more-- and unlike LotR, I DO have them on DVD.

But LotR? Those movies make me ill, by the very nature of their comparing themselves with the novel.

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That's strange, because I remember you saying that you had bought the first two EEs. Let me see if I can find the thread....
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Thingol of Doriath
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Uh-oh! []

*waits to see if Athene can find the posts before Wiki deletes them*

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Roll of Honor Athene
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AHAHAHA!
I can't find the posts, but I do remember the conversation - like you, WiKi, I have an excellent memory....
I asked you to explain why you had spent so much money on something you hated, whereas I, who slightly liked the movies, had spent very much less.
Your response?
You have a lot of disposable income and you can spend it on whatever you choose.
[] [] []
Seem to remember finding that quite funny at the time.

E: To be fair to Nutsy there, I haven't looked for the posts. It may be that he hasn't deleted them. []

[ 01-30-2006, 10:54 AM: Message edited by: Athene ]

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Arien the Maia
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Oh comme on .. we all know that Wiki is a grottesque figure that does everything in extreme. His knowledge in Tolkien is the only thing that makes this persona interesting.
And his childish approach of the movies the only thing that makes him amusing. There's no fun in trying to corner Wiki he's a corner all by himself.

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The Witch-King of Angmar
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(Ignores Arien the Troll-- who ignores everything else)

quote:
That's strange, because I remember you saying that you had bought the first two EEs. Let me see if I can find the thread....
Your memory is erroneous. I said I DOWNLOADED them, and just to see the extended scenes, to see if they were as bad as the rest.

You think I'd give money to someone I hated? That's what DIVORCE is for! And even if I did, you think I'd ADMIT it? Publicly?
Puh-fricking-LEEZE. []

quote:
I can't find the posts,
Isn't that CON-VEEEEN-IENT. I don't make up things about you-- not without proof anyway.

[ 01-30-2006, 05:52 PM: Message edited by: The Witch-King of Angmar ]

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Gollum the great
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I remember you saying the exact same thing, Wiki regarding disposable income.

It sometimes makes me wonder what sort of person could have so much hate coiled up inside of them that they need to attach it to a movie...because seriously at the end of the day that's all these things are... they're frikkin movies.

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
...What we came to realise was that you don't have to put a sword in her hands to make her strong. And where we've come to now is all these true elements of who Arwen is. I mean this is an incredibley powerful and fearless woman filled with so much hope and belief and that is strong enough. ~ Liv Tyler (Arwen)
A proud member of H.A.A.H.A.A.

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Roll of Honor Lillianna
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quote:
because seriously at the end of the day that's all these things are... they're frikkin movies.
a-frikkin-men []
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Miranthridel Bloom
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*A-frikkin-grees*

[]

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Thingol of Doriath
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Whether or not you actually bought or downloaded the movies matters not... even you must admit that you are obsessed with PJ and his movies. You can't even discuss Tolkien's literary works without whining about PJ.

Being so obsessed with something you hate can't be healthy... I'm worried about you Wiki! []

[]

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Roll of Honor Neytari Took-Baggins
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I'm trying to get my head around the fact that you find the first two Harry Potter movies watchable []
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Hidalgo
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WKoA:
quote:
I don't make up things about you-- not without proof anyway.
Ehr, if there were proofs you couldn't be making it up. Unless they were forged proofs.
So... are you implying that you contemplate forging proofs to make things up about Athene? []

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
I am unworthy to remain a citizen of MT, so pay no heed to my words.

In Deo Spes Mea.

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Arien the Maia
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[] Wiki The Sphynx
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Gollum the great
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You'd think that this sort of a rally might show him that he's not well liked, that his opinion on the movies is not wanted and that it would probably be best for all concerned if he turned back time and never registered at MT.
Still...what's the bet he'll be back with a vengeance, determinedly ignoring everything and anything any of us has to say?

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
...What we came to realise was that you don't have to put a sword in her hands to make her strong. And where we've come to now is all these true elements of who Arwen is. I mean this is an incredibley powerful and fearless woman filled with so much hope and belief and that is strong enough. ~ Liv Tyler (Arwen)
A proud member of H.A.A.H.A.A.

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