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Minas Tirith Forums » The Hobbit » Suppose the ending of the book was slightly altered.
Author Topic: Suppose the ending of the book was slightly altered.
Hamfast Gamgee
Guard of the Citadel
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Bad news, the Goblins have won the Bo5a. Some of the Dwarves are slain or imprisoned, but some have fled. Bilbo wakes up on a scattered battlefield. Good news, the Necromancer was properly destroyed and couldn't come back. I wonder what might have happened then. Without Sauron, would people have eventually taken on the Goblins in the mountain and reclaimed it?
From: Bagshot Row, Hobbiton, The Shire! | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Són the Unbearable
Soldier of Gondor
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The mountain was the home of the dwarves, some time in the future the dwarves that are left might form an army and reclaim the mountain, but otherwise I don't think it's much of an interest for the other factions.

The only one with an interest in Erebor is the Wood Elves since they (Thranduil) want those special diamonds, but I don't know if he'd risk his people for it.

With Sauron gone it would of course mean that LOTR never happened, needless to say this would change a lot.

Gondor would most likely be the kingdom to purge the lands of the remnants of evil.
So the goblins would have been exterminated eventually it's just a matter of when the exterminators would feel like getting around to it []

From: The Prancing Pony, Bree | Registered: Mar 2015  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor Varnafindë
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With Sauron gone, would anyone still be interested in the One Ring?

Would Saruman be interested in still searching for it, for his own purposes, when he couldn't pretend that he was trying to hinder Sauron from reclaiming it?

And would he be able to sense where it could be, if there had been no statement from Gollum to go by?

From: Narnia, also connected with Norway | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Aiwrendel
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With Sauron gone and no dragons I think the legend of the riches under the mountain would draw Dwarves, Elves, and Men, there would eventually be another battle with the Goblins on the losing end. Though Goblins are evil enough on their own, I think they became worse (more fierce or bold?) with Sauron’s influence and would be easier to destroy.

A couple thoughts perhaps off the subject:
- Wouldn’t Sauron be able to come back as long as the Ring existed? He did it before. Would not the Wise plan to send the One to the Fire so as not to repeat Islidur failure?
- Aren’t there still dragons in the Withered Heath at this time? Or was only in Thror’s time, as shown on his map, and not in Thorin’s day? If there were lesser Worms would they come to steal the treasure since Smaug was gone? Or would they be less aggressive with Sauron gone (if he ever had any influence on them in the first place, which I’m thinking not.)

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Gollum Gollum
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I don't think Smaug and/or other dragons were influenced by Sauron. One of Gandalf's reasons for helping Thorin was preventing an alliance between Sauron and the dragon.

On dragons after the First Age:
1) Four Rings of Power were destroyed by the dragon-fire. Apart from Scatha and Smaug, no killed dragon is ever mentionned. So some dragons are still likely to be alive.
2) Gandalf to Frodo:
quote:
It has been said that dragon-fire could melt and consume the Rings of Power, but there is not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough [to destroy the One Ring]
From: LOTR, FOTR, Book I, Chapter 2 'The Shadow of the Past'

This can be read as an indication that there are some lesser dragons left in ME.
3) J.R.R. Tolkien:
quote:
Dragons. They had not stopped; since they were active in far later times, close to our own. Have I said anything to suggest the final ending of dragons? If so it should be altered. The only passage I can think of is Vol. I p.70: 'there in not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough'. But that implies, I think, that there are still dragons, if not of full primeval stature.
From: Letter 144

I think the dragon matter is now clear enough []

[ 03-24-2015, 07:29 AM: Message edited by: Gollum Gollum ]

From: Cave in the Misty Mountains | Registered: May 2013  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor Varnafindë
Guard of the Citadel
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quote:
- Wouldn’t Sauron be able to come back as long as the Ring existed? He did it before. Would not the Wise plan to send the One to the Fire so as not to repeat Islidur failure?
How long would it take Gandalf to realise that the One had been found and could be sent to the Fire?
From: Narnia, also connected with Norway | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Hamfast Gamgee
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Well, given the Grey Wizard's usual speed on these matters, I would guess around 60 years. One thing I was wondering with this scenario, though, is how would this affect the actual tales. If, say, some of the Dwarves were still alive, if scattered or imprisoned, wouldn't Gandalf and Bilbo feel duty bound to find out their fate and help them? Sounds a bit like a few more cases of Bilbo using the Ring would be required. Perhaps the Hobbit would be a hundred pages longer and Lotr not exist! Unless, possibly, some Orc-lord might hunger for the One.......
From: Bagshot Row, Hobbiton, The Shire! | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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