Minas Tirith Forums Create a New Topic  Reply to this Topic
profile | register |
search | faq | avatars | citizens
donate | about | library
  This topic is comprised of pages:  1  2 
Minas Tirith Forums » New Line Cinema's Hobbit » Where was Aragorn? (Page 1)
Author Topic: Where was Aragorn?
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
I was a little surprised not to see a young Aragorn running around Rivendell while the dwarves and Bilbo were visiting. I know it's not specifically written in the book, but I believe Aragorn was around 10 years old and living in Rivendell at the time. Hard to believe a 10 year old boy wouldn't be curious about a hobbit, a wizard and a band of dwarves. This would have presented PJ with a canonical of way of tying The Hobbit together with LotR.
From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Aiwrendel
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 965

posted      Profile for Aiwrendel   Author's Homepage   Email Aiwrendel   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
Yes, Aragorn was 10 years old when Bilbo and the dwarves were in Rivendell. It is written in Appendix B - The tale of Years that Aragorn was born March 1, 2931. The Hobbit states Bilbo and the dwarves left Hobbiton at the end of April and arrived in Rivendell in June of 2941 leaving over two weeks later on midsummer’s (Midyear’s) day (between end of June and the beginning of July).

Maybe Aragorn was told to keep his distance and not “bother” the adults. Still, PJ could have shown him peeking around a tree at the Company and later talking to others about what he saw. Or being scolded and called away from the tree by an Elf nanny. That would have been a cute addition but maybe too subtle for PJ’s thought process to conceive.

A scene with Elrond explaining the Company and their mission to young Estel would have been an acceptable addition if done right.

From: Chicago USA | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Maybe Aragorn was told to keep his distance and not “bother” the adults. Still, PJ could have shown him peeking around a tree at the Company and later talking to others about what he saw. Or being scolded and called away from the tree by an Elf nanny. That would have been a cute addition but maybe too subtle for PJ’s thought process to conceive.
That's the sort of thing that would fit nicely, no need to go off the rails and give the child a speaking part or anything. With all the crap that didn't happen that PJ added in the name of continuity, why not add something that in all likelihood DID happen (assuming Aragorn was in Rivendell at the time). Although JRRT didn't show it to us, is there really any reason to believe a 10 year old Aragorn would've been any less curious than a similarly aged Bergil was with Pippin in Minas Tirith? Lil Aragorn peeking around a tree or a column at the traveling company while some frazzled elf scolds him, "get back here you little scamp" would've got a chuckle out of me. []

Edit:
quote:
A scene with Elrond explaining the Company and their mission to young Estel would have been an acceptable addition if done right.
I like this idea too, if only you had written the screenplay! []

[ 04-17-2013, 01:57 PM: Message edited by: Madomir ]

From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Aiwrendel
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 965

posted      Profile for Aiwrendel   Author's Homepage   Email Aiwrendel   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
if only you had written the screenplay
Nah. That wouldn't have worked. I probably would have had young Estel interrupting Thorin with a bunch of questions and Thorin going all W. C. Fields telling him, "Go away kid ya bother me." Once I got my twisted imagination going it would have turned out worse than PJ's.
From: Chicago USA | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
If PJ HAD added Aragorn, I bet you guys would have been the first into Purist Rage to complain about it. []
From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Inc'
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 6274

posted      Profile for Inc'   Email Inc'   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
That's probably very true []
From: Yoshi's Island | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
Let the last 2 posts stand as exhibits A & B to show that you guys, like PJ, don't get it.
From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
Post#1 of this thread stands as Exhibit C - blatant hypocrisy. []

But winding up of purists aside and to comment on your idea, as you clearly are of the opinion that I "don't get it" (even though I never mentioned it)... Why does he need a way to link it with LotR? It's linked fairly well by Mr Tolkien. [] Besides which, at 10 Aragorn would have very little to do with it and his age is only mentioned in the EE. Anyone who hasn't read it or seen those would assume that TH takes place as little as a couple of decades before LotR, which would be more than slightly confusing.

If you're going to bring in Aragorn, why not Gimli? He is around 50 years older than Aragorn and could easily have been brought in to tie the two (if anyone thought it necessary beyond that nice little prologue), but he never gets so much as a mention by his father. You could be there all day dragging in characters from LotR who SHOULD be in TH, once you start.

Inc' []

[ 04-18-2013, 04:28 PM: Message edited by: The DarkQueen Iauraearien ]

From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Post#1 of this thread stands as Exhibit C - blatant hypocrisy.
Huh? You mean this?
quote:
I was a little surprised not to see a young Aragorn running around Rivendell while the dwarves and Bilbo were visiting.
This must be some new definition of blatant hypocrisy with which I'm unfamiliar.
quote:
If you're going to bring in Aragorn, why not Gimli?
Because Gimli wasn't there. PJ would have to invent a way to slide Gimli in somehow to make this work, not so with Aragorn. Here's the distinction you seem to be missing, it was Tolkien who placed a young Aragorn in Rivendell, just like Legolas in Mirkwood, it makes all the difference in the world.

You want hypocrisy? How about defending the idea of Thorin fighting a long dead orc with a 150 year old stick but getting worked up over the concept of a cameo for a character who was actually 'on site' as it were, on the assumption that it might be confusing. []

quote:
You could be there all day dragging in characters from LotR who SHOULD be in TH, once you start.

Such as Galadriel or Saruman or Radagast or even a zombified Azog... we actually agree here, prob'ly best not to travel that road. []

[ 04-19-2013, 12:38 PM: Message edited by: Madomir ]

From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Because Gimli wasn't there.
As far as JRRT was concerned in the context of TH neither was Aragorn. [] A small child running around would have ruined it anyway IMO.

Also, no, not that line in particular, the whole idea. You're constantly slamming PJ for changes which make sense and put the events in context for those who don't know it all, only to suggest one that is totally unnecessary.

[ 04-19-2013, 01:43 PM: Message edited by: The DarkQueen Iauraearien ]

From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
You're constantly slamming PJ for changes which make sense
Not true. With so many unnecessary changes that don't make sense to choose from such as zombie orcs and rabbit fueled Iditarod entries, why would anyone resort to slamming changes that DO make sense? Especially with them being so few and far between, it'd be akin to hunting an endangered species.

Ask yourself this.. will you be upset if Legolas is shown in Mirkwood or at the Battle of Five Armies? And how is this different than showing Aragorn at Rivendell?

[ 04-19-2013, 02:56 PM: Message edited by: Madomir ]

From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Aiwrendel
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 965

posted      Profile for Aiwrendel   Author's Homepage   Email Aiwrendel   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
I’m a bit confused about the bickering about this topic. We all know depictions of events Tolkien didn’t write are a given for a video production because the masses want to see non-stop action and are bored with anything that requires thought. That’s the masses and they pay the bills but what of others? If something is going to be added why not throw a bone to those who would appreciate the context of an addition that has canonical meaning? Something that coincides with Professor Tolkien’s writings?

I’m sorry if I started a flame war with my opinion that PJ is incapable of engendering an emotional reaction in his audiences beyond the primal. I guess it didn’t belong in this thread and I apologize. I’ll save it for the Rage threads.

From: Chicago USA | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Ask yourself this.. will you be upset if Legolas is shown in Mirkwood or at the Battle of Five Armies? And how is this different than showing Aragorn at Rivendell?
What do you mean IF?

 -

I see no problem with this as Legolas is an ADULT at the time and can make a sensible contribution, unlike a 10 year old. []

From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
If something is going to be added why not throw a bone to those who would appreciate the context of an addition that has canonical meaning? Something that coincides with Professor Tolkien’s writings?

Agreed [] Wish I could've said it that clearly []

No need to apologize Aiwrendel for simply expressing your opinion. Bickering happens, as long as nobody gets nasty it's still just an exchange of ideas and therefore, not necessarily a bad thing. At least by putting stuff here there's been some back & forth discussion. The Rage thread, altho very useful, really is more for venting and doesn't lead to as much interaction.

Bicker on!! []

edit...
quote:
I see no problem with this as Legolas is an ADULT at the time and can make a sensible contribution, unlike a 10 year old.
Not so sure PJ had Legolas make a sensible contribution in LotR, but that's a different argument. []

So that's your objection? That young Aragorn doesn't meet the minimum required age to make a cameo appearance? A character is a character, age doesn't matter, should be an insignificant hurdle for an accomplished director.

And to think you criticize arguments against PJ for being trivial []

[ 04-20-2013, 05:20 PM: Message edited by: Madomir ]

From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
I just don't see what contribution a child would make to the story. He'd get under foot, ask stupid questions and have the story repeated to him in a patronising fashion. I praise PJ for un-kiddifying TH and I wouldn't want it putting back there. Perhaps not wanting it to be stupidly childish is trivial, but hey ho. []
From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
He'd get under foot, ask stupid questions and have the story repeated to him in a patronising fashion.
Perhaps working in a younger actor is beyond PJ's skill level and what you described is in fact the way PJ would have handled it; in which case I agree, we're better off without it.

Thank goodness the Game of Thrones crew doesn't share the same inadequacies, otherwise we'd be deprived of seeing Joffrey, Brandan Stark, and most of all Arya Stark. Afterall it's not the age of the character that is the problem, it's the director's ability (or inability) to manage the character that makes the difference.

From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
When you're as successful an author as JRRT or as successful a film director as PJ, criticise. Until then... []

We'd be better off without Joff, Bran and Arya, but at least they are in the book, not shoved in by someone's afterthought.

[ 04-25-2013, 02:39 PM: Message edited by: The DarkQueen Iauraearien ]

From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Madomir
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 3084

posted      Profile for Madomir   Email Madomir   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
When you're as successful an author as JRRT or as successful a film director as PJ, criticise. Until then...
Oh my... so you're saying that because PJ made money with King Kong, he can't be criticized by the likes of me for having Bilbo actually SEE Gollum drop the Ring and then in truth steal it?

By setting PJ up among the unassailable elite, you've damaged your own argument far more than I ever could.

quote:
We'd be better off without Joff, Bran and Arya
Better off without Arya?!?! Hang on I gotta collect myself.. ok, you know what? I like you, so I'm gonna pretend this never happened []

[ 04-27-2013, 12:49 AM: Message edited by: Madomir ]

From: northern hemisphere-ish | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
Everyone likes a good sparring partner. []
From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Hamfast Gamgee
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 5528

posted      Profile for Hamfast Gamgee   Author's Homepage   Email Hamfast Gamgee   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
Personally, I think I might have preferred the Beatles version. Everyone get together in Rivendell and have a sing-song of the Yellow Subrmarine. One, two, three, in the land, were I was born! Far out! Oh, all right, maybe not.

[ 05-11-2013, 10:05 PM: Message edited by: Hamfast Gamgee ]

From: Bagshot Row, Hobbiton, The Shire! | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Roll of Honor The DarkQueen Iauraearien
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 2041

posted      Profile for The DarkQueen Iauraearien   Author's Homepage   Email The DarkQueen Iauraearien   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
Now that would stop me from seeing it. Cannot stand The Beatles. []
From: Mordor | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Hamfast Gamgee
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 5528

posted      Profile for Hamfast Gamgee   Author's Homepage   Email Hamfast Gamgee   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
They were planning on doing Lotr or it might have been the Hobbit, can't remember but Tolkien must have resisted there millions! Can't imagine what they would have made of Tom Bombadil. Unless they would simply cut him out like everyone else.
From: Bagshot Row, Hobbiton, The Shire! | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Snöwdog
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 15

posted      Profile for Snöwdog   Author's Homepage   Email Snöwdog   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Personally, I think I might have preferred the Beatles version. Everyone get together in Rivendell and have a sing-song of the Yellow Subrmarine. One, two, three, in the land, were I was born! Far out!
Well, it IS all about the Ring, right? Now, let's join Ringo and sing along! " ... and he told us of his life..."
From: In the Shadows of Annuminas | Registered: Aug 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Gollum Gollum
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 11392

posted      Profile for Gollum Gollum   Email Gollum Gollum   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
 -
From: Cave in the Misty Mountains | Registered: May 2013  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Aiwrendel
Guard of the Citadel
Citizen # 965

posted      Profile for Aiwrendel   Author's Homepage   Email Aiwrendel   New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post 
Where did you get that? Did they really consider putting an adult Aragorn in the Hobbit movie? []


*They told me I was gullible and I believed them*

From: Chicago USA | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Create a New Topic  Reply to this Topic Minas Tirith Forums » New Line Cinema's Hobbit » Where was Aragorn? (Page 1)
This topic is comprised of pages:  1  2 
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic       The Red Arrow!       Admin Options: Make Topic Sticky   Close Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic

About  ~ • ~  Contact  ~ • ~  Minas Tirith  ~ • ~  F. A. Q.  ~ • ~  Help

Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classic™ 6.6.1