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Minas Tirith Forums » Lord of the Rings » Boromir, Good or Evil? (Page 3)
Author Topic: Boromir, Good or Evil?
Tinelwen
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Goldberry, you cannot in anyway justify that statement. There is no evidence of Boromir being morally decrepid as you seem to think he is. He never acted pretentiously either. He did approach Frodo and attempt to take the ring, but it was only out of the desire to save his fair city, not because he was an evil man. In the end he attoned for his actions, if you will, by sacrificing his own life for those of the other hobbits. With his dying words, he confessed his error to Aragorn and expressed his deep regret for having done such a thing. He was not inheirently evil at all; the pull of the ring was simply too strong for him, but in the end he redeemed himself.

This message has been edited by Tinelwen on 03-28-2001 at


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Tinelwen
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Oh, and Balin, I would gladly accept the noble title of Dwarf Friend, but I would like it to be known that I am a Lady not a Lord...
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Caranthir
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Let's all pretend Goldberry didn't post that, because I'm sure she'll delete it pretty soon...

Boromir was NOT evil. He was taken in by the power of the ring, and being a mere man, could not resist it. He didn't know what he was doing wrong, he thought it was for the good of everyone. So there.


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Roll of Honor Arra
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Boromir was good at heart. He had a strong will, but it wasn't strong enough to pass the test of the ring. Aragorn, Gandalf, and Galadril were all offered the ring by Frodo. They understood that the ring once in their power would turn their intentions of good to evil. They passed the test. Boromir however, did not understand the ring. Thus, he underestimated its power. He falled the test. In the end, he avenged his error. Alas.

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Life is Life and that's what it is.


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Roll of Honor Marcho Blackwood - MSS
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And let us not forget, that his actions are what finally forced Frodo to make a decision and act upon it. No telling how long they may have sat around trying to decide, or even come to blows withing the Fellowship, attempting to come to a conclusion.

I don't thing Boromir was specifically Good or Evil, just human, susceptible to the fears and desires of all humans and, it may be supposed, elves, dwarves and hobbits!

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Marcho Blackwood
#16 Brookshade Close
Bindbale, North Farthing
The Shire

This message has been edited by Marcho Blackwood on 03-29-2001 at


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Goldberry Slinks Back In
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Okay, okay, I give up! I just got replies to my opinion. It's just an opinion! I give up! You win!

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O slender as a willow-wand! O clearer than clear water!
O reed by the living pool. Fair river-daughter!
O spring-time and summer-time, and spring again after!
O wind on the waterfall, and the leaves' laughter!
~Frodo, to Goldberry


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Caranthir
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quote:
It's just an opinion!

And a damned stupid one at that.

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Turgon King of Gondolin
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Yeah I agree with Caranthir
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Mellon
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I for one do not believe Boromir wanted Isuldur's Bane for his own use. He was a warrior with no delusions of wielding it himself. I think he was thinking of others when he discussed taking The Ring and using it against its evil maker.
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radioactiverob
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Let us not forget that ultimately Frodo claimed the ring for himself - though it took a lot longer for his mind to succumb to the temptation than it did Boromir.

Does that make Frodo as 'evil' as some people are labelling Boromir?

I think to Boromir's mind the ring provided an easy solution for to a very difficult situation (the imminent sacking of his beloved city).

However, there does seem to be a difference between the two as we learn from Faramir who tells Frodo that Boromir was always keen for the victory of Gondor (and his own glory therein - or something like that). Frodo exhibited the exact opposite of that type of mentality and I think that is part of the reason he resisted the evil or the ring for so long and why Boromir succumbed to it so quickly.


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Roll of Honor Fingolfin of the Noldor
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Frodo did not take the ring it was given to him.
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radioactiverob
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I don't disagree with you. The claiming of the ring was refering to when he was on Mount Doom, not in The Shire.
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radioactiverob
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Though I would also say rather that the ring was entrusted to Frodo rather than given to him as you could argue that it was not Bilbo's to give.
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Glorfindel
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First of all id like to say that I dont Think youre oppinion was stupid Goldberry, infact it started a very emotional dispute, which i believe is what this post is for, I think it was a good way to bring up some arguments and that we shouldent put Goldberry down, wether we agree with him or not.

I agree, indeed the ring would claim anyone that possesed it but, Frodo held a strong resistance to the will of the ring, although small an furry hobits are strong at heart.
I believe that Frodo displayed more bravery at times, than many great warriors could boast of.

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"It is the Doom of Men that they Forget!"

<FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Glorfindel on 03-30-2001 at </font>

This message has been edited by Glorfindel on 03-30-2001 at


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Snoogins455
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hey Caranthir let it slide you dont have to be jerk, almost everyone surcame(word?) to the ring eventually only the very great resisted and even then only for a short time so Boromir wasnt evil the effects of the ring were not the weilder(alot like the good/evil of the ring thread, similar just more general)
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Mithrandir
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lol, this discussion is long, and i think only like 2 people thought he was evil. we just kept reinforcing the facts
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Roll of Honor Fingolfin of the Noldor
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Yea, this thread is getting pretty redundant.
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Gimli
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Goldberry, your entitled to your opinion. I agree with you infact. Dont be daunted by the vulgar posts, whose authors have no sense of the word honor (with the obvious exception of Glorfindel, whose name shall not be slandered by myself not any man who knows his character, ever!). Until they come up with an excuse better then ...."WAAHHH..the ring was too powerful for poor little Boromir" you stick by your guns.

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"Faithless is he who says 'farewell' when the path darkens"
-Gimli son of Gloin


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Glorfindel
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Although i could never agree whit the idea that Boromir could possibly be eveil i thank you for youre words (all of which are undeserved by one such as I) Noble Gimli Son of Glóin.
Few know the word of honor, and only one do I know, who is nought but honor in its purest form.

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"It is the Doom of Men that they Forget!"


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Mithrandir
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BHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!
gimli thats the funniest thing i've seen in a few days....woo...good laugh.

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Luthien
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I dont think Boromir was evil, but he did succumb for a moment to the wiles of the ring.
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Roll of Honor Lúthien
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I see Boromir more in the tradition of the Aristotelian "Tragic Hero".

He was a noble character ... in more ways than one. He was a basically good man, and was of "noble birth", ie being the heir to the Stewardship of Gondor.

He had a tragic flaw which caused his downfall. You could argue that this was pride, allowing him to think that he could use the ring for good even though so many others had failed at this.

His downfall is obvious ... attacking Frodo and trying to take the ring from him by force.

He even had the chance at recognition of both the harm that he caused and the reason for it.

All of these are characteristics of the "tragic hero" as outlined by Aristotle in "The Poetics".

Tolkien however, takes it a step further and allows Boromir to redeem himself, a chance which was not often afforded to the heroes in Greek tragedy. I believe that this says something important about Tolkien's beliefs.

See -- a theater minor is good for something!

*Edit for spelling

[ 03-27-2003, 01:50 PM: Message edited by: Lúthien ]

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Glorfindel
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An good point indeed, hadn't actualy though about it that way.

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»» "It is the doom of men, that they forget." «««««««««««««««««««««

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Roll of Honor Éomer
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Boromir is only human; he has the potential to be both good and evil. While he is inherently good, he grew up strong and proud and arrogant, basking in the love of his father and of Gondor, and this led to a weak will. When faced with the Ring, he could only think of the salvation of Gondor, his people, and so he greatly desired it. His desire eventually led to his downfall, naturally, but before he fell he redeemed himself through giving his life for Merry and Pippin, despite them still being taken by the Uruk-hai. So in the end Boromir proved his inherent goodness and nobility, despite his flaws which unfortunately revealed themselves at the wrong time.

Although you could argue that they chose the perfect moment to come around. If Boromir had never tried to take the ring, the Fellowship most likely would have never parted, Rohan wouldn't have been saved, Aragorn might not have become king, etc.

So maybe you could say that Boromir was a tool of fate. He was given those faults simply because he was the one chosen to play the role of the Fellowship-breaker in the story. If so, we can never truly prove if Boromir was or was not good or evil, because he did not get to choose the path for himself.

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Roll of Honor Curufin the Crafty
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I don't think it's possible to say that Boromir was good ~or evil.

He was human, which shows that he possesses both strengths and weaknesses.

"Good" and "evil" are subjective terms.

If you're looking at intention, Boromir was "good." He wished to take the Ring in order to aid Gondor in its fight against Mordor, feeling that it would be the only way to defeat Sauron. That is a perfectly "good" and honorable intention.

However, looking from the point of view of an omniscient observer (as we do as readers), we see Boromir in a less positive light, as we know that his belief is fatally flawed, and he is under the Ring's power.

Boromir is not good or evil, he is simply a pawn, first to his father, then to the will of the Ring.

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
To gain that which is worth having, it may be necessary to lose everything else.
~Bernadette Devlin
http://www.shonjir.net

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