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Minas Tirith Forums » Library Council of Minas Tirith » Who or what is Tom Bombadil? (Page 7)
Author Topic: Who or what is Tom Bombadil?
Roll of Honor Thorongil
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[] [] [] *laughs toward MANDOS*

*wonders how Tom could have started the race of the Halflings when they did not even originate near the Shire, but farther east, by the Gladden Fields, while Tom had always lived in the Old Forest.* []


To WiKi, who is to say that Tom and Goldberry were married? Personally I don't believe they were. From reading FotR, we can tell that they not only had separate rooms in Tom's house, but at no time is any sort of romance type thing mentioned. Knowing Tolkien, I would think he would have mentioned something about it if it was there. To be honest, I've always thought that if Tom was not actually Goldberry's father, he was at least more like a father figure to her than a husband. We do know that he had apparently raised her from a baby, so whether he was actually her father or not, he was certainly the only father she had ever known.

Has anyone got any evidence to prove or disprove any of this?

**awaits scathing rebuttal by the Angmarish one.

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Q
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She did treat him like a child though...

And who says that Tom slept on a bed anyways?

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Halion
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Thorongil, they get married in the poem ‘The Adventures of Tom Bombadil’:
quote:
But one day Tom, he went and caught the River-daughter,
in green gown, flowing hair, sitting in the rushes,
singing old water-songs to birds upon the bushes.

He caught her, held her fast! Water-rats went scuttering
reeds hissed, herons cried, and her heart was fluttering.
Said Tom Bombadil: ‘Here’s my pretty maiden!
You shall come home with me! The table is all laden:
yellow cream, honeycomb, white bread and butter;
roses at the window-sill and peeping round the shutter.
You shall come under Hill! Never mind your mother
in her deep weedy pool: there you’ll find no lover!’

Old Tom Bombadil had a merry wedding,
crowned all with buttercups, hat and feather shedding;
his bride with forgetmenots and flag-lilies for garland
was robed all in silver-green. He sang like a starling,
hummed like a honey-bee, lilted to the fiddle,
clasping his river-maid round her slender middle.

As a bonus, here are the first two sentences of a very brief outline (published in HoMe VI: The Return of the Shadow) showing Tolkien’s first thoughts for the hobbits’ visit to the house of Tom Bombadil:
quote:
Tom Bombadil rescues them from Willow Man. He says it was lucky he came that way—he had gone to the water-lily pool for some white water-lilies for Goldberry (my wife).

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Q
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Feather shedding? Didn't know he grew feathers...maybe just some down to stuff the bed with.
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The Witch-King of Angmar
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Roll of Honor Thorongil
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Halion, I stand corrected... I don't know how I forgot about that poem, I know I've read it... []

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Q
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My comment about the poem above:

Oh I see...Goldberry whipped Tom into submission with her flogginlillies (flag lilies) that she wound around her neck and flailed with her head. She did this so he would marry her after he called her mother an old Fogetmop (forgetmenot).

She must have given birth to the first hobbit child right when Tom sqeezed her slender middle! [] [] [] [] [] []
And he comes rolling out, laughing a Tom giggery gingle, and all a winglely wingle... []

[ 05-12-2006, 03:59 AM: Message edited by: MANDOS ]

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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Most likely the most thorough analysis of Tom Bombadil on the net can be found on the LOTR Plaza here.

[ 07-12-2006, 03:12 AM: Message edited by: Herendil ]

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The Witch-King of Angmar
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I think a better analysis would be Anton Chekov's "The Nose--" the moral of which is that writers don't always have to make sense!

[ 07-11-2006, 11:10 AM: Message edited by: The Witch-King of Angmar ]

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Roll of Honor Gna
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quote:
I think a better analysis would be Anton Chekov's "The Nose
Oooh, what's Chekhov's "The Nose" about then? Is it similar to Nikolai Gogol's story of the same name?

*thinks Wiki should have googled "Gogol"*

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Roll of Honor Athene
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You want him to Google Gogol?
[]
*goggles*

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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The LOTR Plaza is down at the moment.

But I also would like to present an observation (originally presented in Amon Hen recently) to MTers:

quote:
We are told at the Council of Elrond that two of Tom's alternative names are Forn and Orald. ...
So...?
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Thingol of Doriath
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Let me translate for everyone...

Forn and Orald together are a scramble of what Tom Bombadil actually is... alittle hint Tolkien left in his works for us to figure out. Did I get that right Herendil? []

I'm notoriously bad at scrambles, let's see...

Dorfornal?
For Ronald?
Lodafrarn?

[]

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Roll of Honor Athene
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ROAR! Fondl...

(No 'e'. Darn it.)

*is also crap at scrambles*
[]

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Thingol of Doriath
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No dor Ralf!

Wait...

Far Noldor?

Tom is a Noldo that strayed faaar away?

Old Fornar?

I suck at these... *waits for Celebrían to show up*

[ 07-12-2006, 05:24 AM: Message edited by: Thingol of Doriath ]

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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For Ronald is correct.
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Roll of Honor Athene
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So he put in Tom just for his own amusement? Still doesn't really explain who or what he invisaged him to be.
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Thingol of Doriath
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So... Tom Bombadil is for himself? Amy Ronald? Some Oxford colleague?

Is there any other Ronald in his life that I am missing?

E: Personally I think "Far Noldor" fits better...

[ 07-12-2006, 05:36 AM: Message edited by: Thingol of Doriath ]

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Roll of Honor Athene
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But Tom can't really be a Noldo. He's too powerful and... odd.
[]

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Thingol of Doriath
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"Far" is the Scandinavian term for "father"... so obviously Tolkien meant for Tom to be Finwë(father of the Noldor) reincarnated and Goldberry to be Míriel. The Old Forest is (also) obviously therefore the gardens of Lórien/Irmo transplanted to Middle-earth.

Is this passive-aggressive? []

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Roll of Honor Athene
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No, just bossy.
[]
Interesting theory...

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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If people do not take anything I post seriously anymore, I would like to point out that this was not my idea; it was presented in Amon Hen by one Mallow Smith. I do not believe in it myself either, but I still thought it would be worth posting. It has been posted on other boards as well.
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Roll of Honor Athene
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quote:
To my eyes he has always been either a Maia or a different spirit all together. Somone who's one of a kind, in the same way Goldberry is.
Arien the Different-Spirit-Altogether, here.

This is what I think too. []

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Eluchil
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Honnestly, I think this is too easy to take just two of his many names and then to arrive at such a conclusion. Most of all when those names have each their own meaning.
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The Witch-King of Angmar
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quote:
You want him to Google Gogol?

*goggles*

*Giggles* []

Actually, I think the best theorization I've seen from literature, is that Bombadil is derived from the Celtic-lore figure of the "unaligned fairy," a type of spirit-being who reputedly came to Earth before the divisions of the others into good and evil-- and so he remains neutral, and uninterested in the affairs of others in this regard.

[ 07-12-2006, 04:32 PM: Message edited by: The Witch-King of Angmar ]

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Create a New Topic  Reply to this Topic Minas Tirith Forums » Library Council of Minas Tirith » Who or what is Tom Bombadil? (Page 7)
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