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Minas Tirith Forums » Library Council of Minas Tirith » Who or what is Tom Bombadil? (Page 0)
Author Topic: Who or what is Tom Bombadil?
Q
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My comment about the poem above:

Oh I see...Goldberry whipped Tom into submission with her flogginlillies (flag lilies) that she wound around her neck and flailed with her head. She did this so he would marry her after he called her mother an old Fogetmop (forgetmenot).

She must have given birth to the first hobbit child right when Tom sqeezed her slender middle! [] [] [] [] [] []
And he comes rolling out, laughing a Tom giggery gingle, and all a winglely wingle... []

[ 05-12-2006, 03:59 AM: Message edited by: MANDOS ]

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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Most likely the most thorough analysis of Tom Bombadil on the net can be found on the LOTR Plaza here.

[ 07-12-2006, 03:12 AM: Message edited by: Herendil ]

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The Witch-King of Angmar
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I think a better analysis would be Anton Chekov's "The Nose--" the moral of which is that writers don't always have to make sense!

[ 07-11-2006, 11:10 AM: Message edited by: The Witch-King of Angmar ]

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Roll of Honor Gna
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quote:
I think a better analysis would be Anton Chekov's "The Nose
Oooh, what's Chekhov's "The Nose" about then? Is it similar to Nikolai Gogol's story of the same name?

*thinks Wiki should have googled "Gogol"*

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Roll of Honor Athene
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You want him to Google Gogol?
[]
*goggles*

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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The LOTR Plaza is down at the moment.

But I also would like to present an observation (originally presented in Amon Hen recently) to MTers:

quote:
We are told at the Council of Elrond that two of Tom's alternative names are Forn and Orald. ...
So...?
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Thingol of Doriath
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Let me translate for everyone...

Forn and Orald together are a scramble of what Tom Bombadil actually is... alittle hint Tolkien left in his works for us to figure out. Did I get that right Herendil? []

I'm notoriously bad at scrambles, let's see...

Dorfornal?
For Ronald?
Lodafrarn?

[]

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Roll of Honor Athene
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ROAR! Fondl...

(No 'e'. Darn it.)

*is also crap at scrambles*
[]

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Thingol of Doriath
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No dor Ralf!

Wait...

Far Noldor?

Tom is a Noldo that strayed faaar away?

Old Fornar?

I suck at these... *waits for Celebrían to show up*

[ 07-12-2006, 05:24 AM: Message edited by: Thingol of Doriath ]

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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For Ronald is correct.
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Roll of Honor Athene
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So he put in Tom just for his own amusement? Still doesn't really explain who or what he invisaged him to be.
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Thingol of Doriath
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So... Tom Bombadil is for himself? Amy Ronald? Some Oxford colleague?

Is there any other Ronald in his life that I am missing?

E: Personally I think "Far Noldor" fits better...

[ 07-12-2006, 05:36 AM: Message edited by: Thingol of Doriath ]

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Roll of Honor Athene
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But Tom can't really be a Noldo. He's too powerful and... odd.
[]

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Thingol of Doriath
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"Far" is the Scandinavian term for "father"... so obviously Tolkien meant for Tom to be Finwë(father of the Noldor) reincarnated and Goldberry to be Míriel. The Old Forest is (also) obviously therefore the gardens of Lórien/Irmo transplanted to Middle-earth.

Is this passive-aggressive? []

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Roll of Honor Athene
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No, just bossy.
[]
Interesting theory...

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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If people do not take anything I post seriously anymore, I would like to point out that this was not my idea; it was presented in Amon Hen by one Mallow Smith. I do not believe in it myself either, but I still thought it would be worth posting. It has been posted on other boards as well.
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Roll of Honor Athene
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quote:
To my eyes he has always been either a Maia or a different spirit all together. Somone who's one of a kind, in the same way Goldberry is.
Arien the Different-Spirit-Altogether, here.

This is what I think too. []

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Eluchil
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Honnestly, I think this is too easy to take just two of his many names and then to arrive at such a conclusion. Most of all when those names have each their own meaning.
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The Witch-King of Angmar
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quote:
You want him to Google Gogol?

*goggles*

*Giggles* []

Actually, I think the best theorization I've seen from literature, is that Bombadil is derived from the Celtic-lore figure of the "unaligned fairy," a type of spirit-being who reputedly came to Earth before the divisions of the others into good and evil-- and so he remains neutral, and uninterested in the affairs of others in this regard.

[ 07-12-2006, 04:32 PM: Message edited by: The Witch-King of Angmar ]

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Thingol of Doriath
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quote:
If people do not take anything I post seriously anymore, I would like to point out that this was not my idea; it was presented in Amon Hen by one Mallow Smith.
Oh... I'm just pulling your leg a bit. [] No harm, no foul.

As Eluchil said, it is quite a stretch. Plus "For Ronald" doesn't mean anything. My theory("Far Noldor") actually would make more sense. []

If we went around scrambling combinations of Tolkien names... you could basically come up with anything and everything. Who knows... one might even find the Entwives.

*wanders off to scramble "Brown Lands", "Teleporno" and "Treebeard"*

[]

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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quote:
Plus "For Ronald" doesn't mean anything.
It would mean that Tom Bombadil is 'for Ronald' - that Tom Bombadil is Tolkien, that Tolkien inserted himself into his creation.


quote:
If we went around scrambling combinations of Tolkien names... you could basically come up with anything and everything.
I agree, but in this case we are dealing with two names for the same character, and the character happens to be the most mysterious in Tolkien's works.
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Thingol of Doriath
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quote:
It would mean that Tom Bombadil is 'for Ronald' - that Tom Bombadil is Tolkien, that Tolkien inserted himself into his creation.

It would also mean that he refers to himself in third person... a la Knuckle Dragger, and uses one of his three names that I've never heard him go by.

No, no... I can't buy this. [] At any rate, it doesn't explain who Tom Bombadil is within the confines of the mythology.

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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quote:
It would also mean that he [Tolkien] refers to himself in third person...
But is that not more natural to the reader than referring to himself as 'me'?


quote:
... [Tolkien] uses one of his three names that I've never heard him go by.
Biography:
quote:
This ['Ronald'] was the name by which Arthur and Mabel came to address their son, the name that would be used by his relatives and later by his wife. Yet he sometimes said that he did not feel it to be his real name; indeed people seemed to feel faintly uncomfortable when choosing how to address him.
quote:
At any rate, it doesn't explain who Tom Bombadil is within the confines of the mythology.
But it may be that Tolkien did not have a place within the mythology in mind for him. We should not just look for such an explanation for Tom, but also exterior explanations.

[ 07-13-2006, 08:18 AM: Message edited by: Herendil ]

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Roll of Honor Thorin
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[]
Coincidence. I just can't imagine it.

Has any of our language masters taken a look at these other names? Are there meanings for them?

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Roll of Honor Herendil
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Reader's Companion, Nomenclature:

quote:
Forn is actually the Scandinavian word for '(belonging to) ancient (days)'.
quote:
Orald is an Old English word for 'very ancient', evidently meant to represent the language of the Rohirrim and their kin.

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