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Minas Tirith Forums » The Green Dragon » Spirit of Fire - A Word Aside (Page 1)
Author Topic: Spirit of Fire - A Word Aside
Amárië
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This is a First Age, Silmarillion-based Role Play I've been wanting to do for some time. It is part of the sequence of RP's I'm currently in, including A Memory Fair but Unfinished, Blood Brothers, and Flight of the Noldor. This one, however, comes first.

This is Fëanáro's story.

I see it beginning around the time of Míriel's death and covering the period where it's just him and Finwë. It would then move on to Finwë's marriage with Indis, the birth of Nolofinwë and Arafinwë, and Fëanáro's marriage to Nerdanel. I want to examine closely Fëanáro's marriage to Nerdanel, because it seems that they had a rather deep relationship, and it is my hypothesis that he loved her deeply right up to his death, despite their estrangement.

This RP would end where A Memory Fair but Unfinished begins.

I would play Fëanáro (and Maehdros when we get that far, since I already play him in Blood Brothers).

If you are already playing a character in Memory, Blood Brothers or Flight, it is my dearest wish that you would keep that character here, and possibly pick up another. []

This is part of the Noldor Quartet

[ 03-11-2008, 09:24 AM: Message edited by: Amárië ]

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Hamfast Gamgee
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Sounds interesting, I think I might like to join. Can I be Amrod and Amras? Should be good playing those two as very little is said about them!

[ 11-07-2007, 02:57 PM: Message edited by: Hamfast Gamgee ]

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Amárië
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Yes, as long as you realize that it could be a long time before either of them will need to be played.
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Roll of Honor Varnafindë
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Since Artanis' father isn't born yet, it will take some time before she is needed, too []
I claim her for whenever that is, though. []

I'll have to think about whether I'd try to have a go at one of the others ...
Indis would be a challenge, wouldn't she?

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Amárië
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I'd love for you to play Indis! [] Or Nerdanel, if you like. Nerdanel has to be one of the strongest women in Tolkien. []
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Roll of Honor Varnafindë
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I don't know whether I could manage to play Nerdanel - I would have to read up more on her first before I know ... And it might require more frequent posting, I think - although this series is often moving fairly slowly anyway.

I'll read more about both her and Indis, and think about it - but if someone else knows right now that (s)he would like to play Nerdanel, feel free to claim her, and I'll stick to Indis.

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Amárië
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Does anyone (Elu, perhaps?) have a timeline of these events?

I know Fëanáro is young when he marries Nerdanel, but how young? Is it before or after Finwë remarries? Is Maedhros older than Arafinwë or Nolofinwë? I don't have any of my books, unfortunately, so I can't find these things myself. []

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Hamfast Gamgee
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Good list of characters there, Amarie, but I have just realized you've forgotten someone, a rather important someone to!
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Roll of Honor Varnafindë
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A timeline is presented in this thread.

It has been discussed in other threads as well (which I can't find) - partly because it doesn't give the source for the datings, partly because it's difficult to see what are the different kinds of years (Valian, of the Trees, of the Sun etc.)
quote:
Feanor would have been 10 years old when he married Nerdanel, or 16 at the latest. I thought the elves didn't reach maturity until around 50.

Time Of The Trees -
1169(4669): Feanor born
1179(4679): Feanor weds Nerdanel (at earliest)
1185(4685): Feanor weds Nerdanel (at latest)

quote:
I would assume they are Valian years as it is in the time of the Trees, but I cannot give you a definite answer. If you are right, I believe those years are longer than years of the Sun, so it would make even more sense(could someone clear this up, as I am not sure).

Also it is not that hard to believe as Feanor not only married in his youth, but had a fleeter childhood than most because he "grew swiftly, as if a secret fire were kindled within him" (Silm, of Feanor)


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Amárië
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Ah, so he's very, very young when he marries.

I'd rather it be closer to 16 if we're going with that. []

Hamfast - who did I forget?

Edit:

quote:
4669 Fëanor born
4670 Death of Míriel
4672 Doom of Manwë concerning the espousals of the Eldar
4679 Rúmil creates the Tengwar Fëanor weds Nerdanel (at earliest)
4684 Finwë meets Indis
4685 Fëanor weds Nerdanel (at latest) Finwë weds Indis
4690 Ñolofinwë (Fingolfin) born
4700 Lúthien born
4730 Arafinwë (Finarfin) born
4750 Fëanor creates the Cirth Dwarrows enter Beleriand
4780 Arafinwë weds Eärwen Findekáno (Fingon) born
4800 Turukáno (Turgon) and Findaráto (Finrod) born Menegroth constructed (begins construction?) Daeron creates his runes
4820 Orks first seen in West Beleriand Thingol meets the Dwarrows
4830 Orks first seen in East Beleriand
4850 Green-elves enter Beleriand (Menegroth completed?)
4862 Alatáriel (Galadriel) and Írissë (Aredhel) born
4900 Melkor released from bondage
4910 Melkor befriends the Ñoldor
4949 Fëanor begins constructing the Silmarils
4950 Fëanor completes the Silmarils Melkor begins the dissention of the Ñoldor
4969 Itarillë (Idril) born
4990 Fëanor banned from Tirion
4992 Melkor allies with Ungoliant
4995 Ungoliant destroys the Two Trees Melkor slays Finwë and steals the Silmarils First Kinslaying

4996 Doom and Prophecy of Mandos
4997 First Battle of Beleriand Death of Denethor Fëanor and sons enter Beleriand
4998 Dagor Nuin-Giliath Death of Fëanor Maedhros captured

So this has Fëanáro marrying, at latest, the same year as Finwë. Therefore, it is entirely possible that Maedhros or even Maglor could be older than Arafinwë and Nolofinwë. Before we actually start, I'd like to get an agreed-upon timeline.

[ 11-07-2007, 11:54 PM: Message edited by: Amárië ]

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Eluchil
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Excepting that several of those dates are completely unattested []

Here are the attested (and interesting) ones :
  • 1169 : birth of Fëanor
  • 1170 : Míriel in Mandos
  • 1172 : Statute of Finwë and Míriel
  • 1185 : marriage of Finwë and Indis.
  • 1190 : birth of Fingolfin
  • 1230 : birth of Finarfin
  • 1250 : Fëanor further elaborates the Rúmilian system
  • 1280 : marriage of Finarfin and Eärwen
  • 1300 : births of Turgon and Finrod
  • 1362 : births of Aredhel and Galadriel
  • 1400 : release of Melkor
  • 1410 : Melkor starts spreading his lies
  • 1450 : making of the Silmarils; unrest due to Melkor's lies begins among the Noldor
  • 1490 : ban of Fëanor; Fingolfin rules in Tirion
  • 1492 : Melkor at Formenos, then to Avathar
  • 1495 : death of the Trees, murder of Finwë. Oath of Fëanor and Exile of the Noldor. First Kinslaying.
  • 1496 : Prophecy of Mandos
  • 1497 : Helcaraxë; Fëanor disappears with the boats
  • 1498 : death of Fëanor

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Amárië
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Thanks, Elu, I knew you could set us straight!

When would you set the marriage of Fëanor? Certainly before Fingolfin's marriage, I should think - it says Fëanor married rather young, and he's significantly older than Fingolfin.

And is there anything whatsoever that would give us any idea on the birth of Maedhros and Fëanor's other sons?

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Eluchil
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In the Silmarillion, his marriage is mentioned before Finwë's second one.

As for his sons, nothing can be said, excepting that they were all born well before the ban at Formenos []

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Amárië
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Ok.

So are there any objections if I set Fëanor and Nerdanel's marriage in 1184?

The births of their sons maybe somewhat like this:

Maedhros: 1189
Maglor: 1219
Celgorm: 1249
Curufin: 1279
Caranthir: 1309
Amrod and Amras: 1339.

That's exactly thiry years betwen and can be altered somewhat, but is there anything wrong with staying close to those dates?

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Roll of Honor Varnafindë
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quote:
Excepting that several of those dates are completely unattested
I couldn't find the thread which discussed that, but I remember it.

Yes, it's good to know which dates are from Tolkien and which ones may be invented by someone else.
We can invent those that we need - I have a special version of that timeline spreadsheet, with the rows of my own inventions (like the birth of Arindis, and the years of the RPs) in a different colour.
I'll put the birth years of Fëanor's sons into my spreadsheet, unless Eluchil rules otherwise []

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Eluchil
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It's ok form me - though this makes Maedhros much older than Fingon.
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Amárië
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Realistically, he probably would be, though, wouldn't he? I mean, his father is significantly older than Fingon's father.
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Eluchil
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Of course, but that's sometime difficult to forget the Mannish point of view ...
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Hamfast Gamgee
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Well, I have to admit that I was a little puzzled about Melkor, because I had a feeling he was about for at least the time of the birth of Feanor's children, that was the character I thought you had forgotten about Amarie, but I'm not sure you want him in the story. If you happen to do, I'd love to play him []
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Amárië
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Hmm. I don't know that we've ever had a Vala played before. I'm not sure how comfortable I am with the idea of it. It seems a bit strange. []
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Hamfast Gamgee
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Sounds like a no to me. Ah, well, I wonder what everyone else thinks. Have to admit that I only know this period from what is written in the Silmarillion. I think I have read the Shibboleth of Feanor, but I wouldn't really say that I know it!
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Amárië
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Not necessarily a "no." You'll notice that Elu, Varna and I act as a team, so we'll have to see what they say too.
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Roll of Honor Varnafindë
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I'd prefer to have Melkor just in the background like Sauron is in LotR. Not actually played by anyone, just observed from the point of view of the other characters.
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Eluchil
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I would not disagree on Melkor being played (though I prefer Varna's idea) but, should it be so, in order to understand the character as much as possible, one should know Texts VI and VII of Myths Transformed, and the Ósanwe-kenta. Melkor is a very difficult character ...
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Amárië
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I REALLY wish I'd been able to bring some of my books with me. I might have to run into town tomorrow and see if I can find The Silmarillion and some of the Histories. It's killing me to not have them while I'm doing these RP's!

EDIT: Problem solved! I just ordered The Silmarillion and HOME 10 and 12 on Amazon. [] Should be here by the end of the week.

[ 11-11-2007, 01:50 PM: Message edited by: Amárië ]

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